Lieberman-Kyl’s Iran amendment passes
Tim Swanson,
September 26, 2007
Not content with letting the House rattle its bellicose sabers, by a 76-22 vote, the Senate just passed a measure that contains harsh tones, to:
“combat, contain and [stop]” Iran via “military instruments.”
Does anyone else remember the wargame, Millennium Challenge ‘02?
Via Robin T.
Update: see TP for an update on the language that was passed in this non-binding resolution.
Jay R.
September 26th, 2007 at 12:22 pm
Obscene.
Like most on the real left, I’m sickened by the by the war-mongering AIPACking “leadership” of the rump Democrats.
Jenkins
September 26th, 2007 at 12:37 pm
Here’s your opposition party right here:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/9/26/75654/5471
69% of Kossacks want a draft. Just so some of those meanie Republicans will be forced to “be equally on the hook for defending our freedom in Iraq and Afghanistan.” Defending our freedom. Uh huh.
John
September 26th, 2007 at 12:50 pm
Again it’s the Zionists. The last century saw the decay and downfall of communism and fascism , and this century will ultimately see the destruction of Zionism, the other great evil.
They will not fool the vast majority of Americans forever.
David
September 26th, 2007 at 1:18 pm
Again that helpless sinking feeling… I have to remind myself that if Hitler or Napoleon had not overreached, they might have held onto everything they had taken and remained in power indefinitely, like Franco. But how many millions will perish in this conflict and who of us will be left to put the pieces back together?
Adam
September 26th, 2007 at 1:40 pm
I thought one war for Israel was enough, looks like we are going to fight another one.
Daveg
September 26th, 2007 at 1:55 pm
The senate was just a “sense of the senate” no?
Will it lead to more sanctions on its own?
Rebel in CA
September 26th, 2007 at 3:20 pm
Lieberman-Kyl was called a “sense of senate” Amendment.
Apparently the senate has no sense whatsoever, including the following
Hillary Clinton: Voted Yea. Remember “If I knew then what I know now I would have never voted for the Iraq war.” What is her excuse this time; and she has the nerve to seek the Democratic nomination for President?
Harry Reid: Voted Yea. Remember “The people have spoken and we will amke sure our troops come home. Well, prunes-for-testicles not only has not brought the troops home, he just made sure even more of them will die in the name of Zionism.
We need a third party in this country.
lester
September 26th, 2007 at 4:00 pm
is this the “new direction for america”? its the same direction as before
Fred in Japan
September 26th, 2007 at 4:32 pm
Funny how this vote occurs just as the latest bogeyman/Hitler/Hussein/Bin Laden visits ameriKKKA. If having a stupid loudmouth as President qualifies one’s country to be bombed, then we are all in big trouble!
Chris S
September 26th, 2007 at 4:40 pm
I thought the first one was for Cheney and the neocons?
mmckinl
September 26th, 2007 at 5:46 pm
The War Party is alive and well …
Check out Naomi Kleins New Book : Disaster Capitalism …
She has given a name to our disease …
Our Republic is on its last legs , politically , economically , ethicly and morally …
Ian Evergood
September 26th, 2007 at 7:43 pm
There’s two ways to look at this. Either we need a third party, because in America fascism is “bipartisan”, or we just need a second party, the Peace Party, to oppose the War Party. Something that has been suggested in a rhetorical sense here at antiwar.com before, but I think it’s time to start moving beyond the rhetorical to at least the exploratory phase of creating that. It can even be seen as a time-limited effort, because it will have to bring together elements of right and left that have fundamental differences on economic and social policy, but that share the recognition that constant war, the gutting of our basic liberties, and a plague of kleptocratic locusts on the treasury are making the other positive visions of either left or right impossible.
Alan MacDonald
September 26th, 2007 at 7:46 pm
A shameful but predictable vote by the political pawns of the global corporate Empire which now runs this facade of “Vichy America”
Tim R.
September 26th, 2007 at 9:10 pm
Question: Are there any times when those on this blog feel that the use of US Military force is justified? After being attacked on 9/11 did we have the moral authority to defend ourselves? Or should we just sit back and “turned the other cheek?”
How many thousands of our citizens have to die before we are allowed to defend ourself agaist the Islamic Fascists?
And don’t tell me Iran never attacked us because they did. They took over our embassy in 1979 and held 52 of our citizens hostage for 444 days. They also were behind the Hizzboluh bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut in 1983, killing 241 US Marines.
And, heres one most people are not aware of: Read the 9/11 Commission Report, Iran in the period leading up to 9/11/01 offered safe passage to many of the hijakers and other Al-Quida Nazi’s on their way to training in Afghanistan. Further, Iran approached Bin Laden after the bombing of the USS Cole and offered a plan where they would both work together for future attacks. Bin Laden ended up turning them down.
So my question is, how many of our citizens have to die for us to defend ourselves? How many more September 11th attacks have to come? How many more plans have to be hijacked? When are we allowed to defend ourselves? Do we have to sit by and let these radicals get nuclear weapons so they can then kill MILLIONS?
justaguy
September 26th, 2007 at 9:43 pm
Must…….not…..take……the…….bait.
Tim R. Please learn some real history and stop spewing the comic book variety.
Damn it.
Ed March
September 26th, 2007 at 10:02 pm
How can people take Bush’s bait over and over again? It’s the SAME PEOPLE who bought into Bush’s warmongering last time that are repeating Bush’s warmongering this time. Anything that their TV says suddenly becomes ‘their’ opinion. Bizarre.
“Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else’s opinions, thier lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.”
Oscar Wilde
Weston J. Kathman
September 26th, 2007 at 10:51 pm
Tim R.,
What does attacking Iraq or Iran have to do with 9/11? Neither of those countries had anything to do with that tragedy. As to Iran’s attacks on Americans, the events you site took place over 20 years ago; it seems that any counteraction against that nation should have happened in the immediate aftermath of those attacks. How many Americans have died in this reckless War on Terror — of which Iraq is said to be a part — not to mention all of the other preemptive conflicts in which this nation has been embroiled since World War II? Invoking 9/11 as a defense for this nation’s non-defensive wars is the first sign that a person does not have a legitimate argument. And why should innocent Iranians have to die just because their political rulers gave safe haven to terrorists? How is that the fault of innocent civilians? The full-scale wars the U.S. Government launches these days are unconsitutional, preemptive, and aggressive. They have nothing to do with defense; they are designed to fill the coffers of the military industrial complex while simultaneously serving the perverse empire-building obsessions of the neocons.
Weston J. Kathman
R. Nelson
September 26th, 2007 at 11:11 pm
Where the hell do people like this Tim R. and Michael Ledeen get off yapping about Iran’s “war on America” since 1979? Have these quarter-wits forgotten it was America that overthrew Iran’s elected government in 1953 and installed that murderous monstrosity the Shah? To no thinking person’s surprise the blowback from Iran was the ayatollah Khomeini.
Yet for all that Iran has never attacked us and in fact, no doubt awed by Bush’s lunatic attack on Iraq, which country had also never threatened us, offered complete cooperation with us on just about everything. And yet we have to suffer the slings and arrows of historically ignorant warmongers who’ve yet to sate themselves on innocent blood. God spare us blackhearted buffoons.
abraham
September 27th, 2007 at 12:51 am
Tim,
Why do you hate America?
Jim Jim
September 27th, 2007 at 12:55 am
The Dems just lost the next election, as far as I’m concerned. As the dollar sinks out of site and no end in site for our wars. We head towards the same end as the Soviet Union. A bankrupt police state.
Saying “Islamic Fascists” = I’m a moron!
Marco
September 27th, 2007 at 1:23 am
War is never a solution. Starting the Iraq war was an error. Starting a Iran war would be a desaster.
Carter M
September 27th, 2007 at 4:31 am
Tim R. thanks for clarifying the fact that Iran never attacked us.
They took over the embassy in Tehran: nerve center for intel agencies that had fomented a coup against a democratically-elected leader and replaced him with the Shah, a brutal dictator on a level with Saddam Hussein.
They supported (maybe) a group trying to drive invaders from their country (Lebanon).
They’ve invaded and occupied neighboring countries…oops, sorry, that’s Israel.
Anything I missed?
Tim
September 27th, 2007 at 5:25 am
They will not fool the vast majority of Americans forever.
They have done a good job so far.
lester
September 27th, 2007 at 6:23 am
100 hours of bulls**t
Marycatherine Barton
September 27th, 2007 at 7:35 am
So proud of Senator Lugar,R. for voting nay to Kyl/Lieberman, but, to put it mildly, very IRRITATED with Senator Bayh,D. for voting yea, with Senator Clinton, now a twosome re vote choosing I bet. I more and more understand why the Indiana Democrat Party chose not to run a candidate in the last general election for U.S. Senator, against Lugar. Tell your senators what you think.
Weston J. Kathman
September 27th, 2007 at 10:25 am
Tim R.,
Thank you for again demonstrating the illegitimacy of your arguments. One of the most popular ploys used by those who cannot reasonably explain their support for preemptive wars is to smear dissenters against U.S. foreign policy as America haters. I cannot count how many times I’ve heard the nonsensical canard of the “Blame America First Crowd.” Do you not recognize that there is a difference between the people of this country and the demonic government that rules them? America and the federal government are two separate entities. As far as I’m concerned, a truly pro-American patriot will oppose every measure the government takes (and this goes well beyond its fascist foreign policy). You need to come up with an argument that actually has substance.
Weston J. Kathman
Weston J. Kathman
September 27th, 2007 at 10:29 am
Correction: I made the mistake of thinking that Tim R. had accused me of hating America when, in fact, someone else was accusing him of the same thing. In Tim R.’s defense, it seems unreasonable to label his comments anti-American. I believe what he said is wrong, but I assume that he is entirely sincere in his beliefs and that he does not deserve to be attacked personally for his views.
Weston J. Kathman
wadosy
September 27th, 2007 at 11:30 am
the israelis have to have a war with iran to close hormuz, and hormuz has to remain closed long enough to plumb persian gulf oil through israel, thus making israel the energy hub of the persian gulf oil patch, this ensuring israel’s survival once america collapses from oil shortages.
but first, one of chertoff’s “gut feelings” has to materialize in america to rally support for the draft, which will provide the manpower necessary to grab iran’s oil, most of which is just across the river from basra.
after iran’s oil is grabbed, the campaign will mysteriously bog down, leaving hormuz in iran’s hands and closed.
BUT, before one of chertoff’s “gut feelings” can materialize with any credibility, iran must be provided with a credible motive to do a chertoff “gut feeling” attack on america, which is why [i]somebody[/i], israel or america, must bomb iran.
…then another chertoff “gut feeling” operation can be visited on america by the same people who did 9/11, the mother of all chertoff “gut feeling” operations.
Hi
September 27th, 2007 at 10:46 pm
A counterweight to Aipac would be nice as well.
Tim R.
September 27th, 2007 at 11:17 pm
To Walter J. Kathman,
I want to thank you for demonstrating that people can disagree with each other but can do so in a dignified way. I believe you to be a person of good will and that people of good will can disagree with each other in a civilized manner. We both want what is best for our country, we just disagree as far as what means to employ.
Perhaps if more people stopped shouting and insulting each other, we could all actually hear each other and learn a thing or two from each other. Again, thank you for your civility and reasonableness, it is a refreshing change compared to many of the hateful and vile comments I have recieved from others on this blog.
R. Nelson
September 28th, 2007 at 12:27 am
Now if you’re done whining, why not refute those mean, nasty charges made against you? For example, show how it’s really wasn’t America that smashed Iran’s democratic government in favor of tyranny. Or supported Iran’s main enemy Iraq with money, intel, and supplies in the 1980s, all used against Iran. You know, regale us with the truth and that sort of thing.
Tim R.
September 29th, 2007 at 8:32 pm
Yes, I agree with you, the United States has done some awful things and made some terrible mistakes! I totally agree with you that we should not have helped to overthrow the Iranian Prime Minister, Mossedegh, in 1953. And it was morally wrong to send chemical weapons and military hardware to Iraq while Saddam used those weapons to attack Iranian civilians. Although at the time we thought Saddam was the lesser of two evils. You know the old saying, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
You see, I admit that we have done irresponsible things and made mistakes. We as a nation must own up to them. HOWEVER, that does not in any way shape or form negate the very real threat posed my Islamic Fascists in Iran today. They attacked our embassy in 1979, they kidnapped our citizens, and they killed 241 of our Marines. They have shown themselves to be a grave danger to us and we have a right and a duty to defend ourselves against Islamic radicals such as these.
Just because we made awful, and sometimes inexcusable mistakes in the past, that does not alter the fact that Iran today is a radical and insane regime filled with Islamic maniacs who foster terrorism throughout the world. Their President denies the Holocaust and calls America the “Great Satan.” And as French Predident Sarkozy recently said, an Iran with a nuclear weapon would be catostrophic.
Tim R.
September 29th, 2007 at 10:20 pm
For those of you defending Iran:
Just wanted you to know the following: Shortly after the Islamic Fascists took power in 1979 they instituted a law that allows young girls, as young as 9 years old, to be given over for marriage. Apparently this is the norm in many Islamic Fascist societies and they take after their prophet who married a 6 year old and consumated it when she was 9.
In Iran forcing a nine year old to have sex might be called a “marriage” but over here in the good ol US of A we have different names for it such as a criminal act, a felony, pedophilia, etc.
Just something to ponder as you folks keep defending Iran.
abraham
September 30th, 2007 at 11:22 pm
Tim,
I ask again: why do you hate America?
Colonel_Khadafis_Fried_Chadian
October 4th, 2007 at 9:57 am
Prehaps you should mention that the 9/11 comission also concluded that there were no proof that Iran knew in advance about 9/11. But i guess its okay to invade Iran because after all we are not at war with nations but ISLAMIC FACISM!1
And of course the big difference between the ISLAMIC FACISTS!1 in Iran and the ISLAMIC FACISTS!1 in Saudi Arabia is that the ISLAMIC FACISTS! in Saudi are quite keen on doing business with America. Just saying, as you blindly goosestep for USRael.
Colonel_Khadafis_Fried_Chadian
October 5th, 2007 at 4:11 am
Furthermore Tim i knew about Iran and Al Qaeda. In fact i read this on CNN’S homepage in 2004. Where were you then? Too busy cheerleading for Bushs other war to care about the country wich you should have considered as the real threath if you are not a complete and utter hypocrite?
We antiwarriors told your kind that historically Iran and terrorists have more in common than Iraq. You didnt listen. Why should we listen now?
Colonel_Khadafis_Fried_Chadian
October 6th, 2007 at 2:47 am
And finally if were supposed to bomb everyone thats ever given some kind of support to Al Qaeda that would mean a good uprooting of all the middle east and a respectable portion of the western world. Dont forget that most Al Qaeda cells live undetected in their countries of choiche feeding of the fat of the land.
I dont know how anyone could take the philosophy of a man whom in the 60’s recomended LBJ to bomb the countryside in Vietnam, seriously let alone what he is not doing in prison.